One of the problems with this kind of marketing is that there are essentially no base-models available at dealerships. So the flexibility supposedly provided by making the gauge cluster an option is not actually available to the consumer. This is just a money-grab while advertising a low price.
The ads all show the fully loaded model, "starting from" $LowPrice. We need a rule that the price shown is for the fully loaded model ($HighPrice), maybe fine print "configurable as low as $LowPrice". And then they have to actually allow you to configure that base model, and stock it. Otherwise, it's just effectively false advertising when every dealership gets just one base model that they will not sell to you.
It gets even more fun than that. As a datapoint my parent wanted a manual Honda Accord. In order to be able to advertise that price, Honda had to have a grand total of 3 manual Accords cars available in all of California.
Source -- Had a broker find the car and that was the story the broker told us (they found a manual but we had to travel from San Diego to San Dimas (2 hr drive) to get it.
Two notes - 1, this applies only to a pair of base models in the Korean market (for now) and 2, the info is still there, but it's on the central screen and not on the instrument cluster behind the wheel.
As a driver I would be so freaking confused staring at the empty space behind the wheel. Maybe it is just my Gen X experience of learning to drive on a stick and paying attention to tachometer and coolant temp.
I drove a Toyota Yaris for about 10 years and those cars had the instrument cluster in the middle of the dash. It didn’t take long to get used to and one of the unexpected benefits was how much better forward visibility was. The Yaris wasn’t a big car but honestly the drivers position felt a lot more open and less cramped with that layout, and realistically the center of the dash is almost always empty space anyway. I personally liked it a lot. Not sure the “no instrument cluster + massive iPad in the center” is going to be quite the same feel or work as well, but everything being in the center feels way less weird than you would think.
> Maybe it is just my Gen X experience of learning to drive on a stick and paying attention to tachometer and coolant temp.
You and your fancy cars... my 1981 Vanagon doesn't have fancy stuff like a tach or a trip meter or a temperature gauge. Who needs a tach when you have ears, and anyway there's a colored dot on the speedometer at the top end of first, two dots at the top end of 2nd and three dots at the top end of 3rd. If you go over, the rev limiter will let you know.
While working on the speedometer, I did drive it a bit with no cluster installed, and it was weird, but I could get used to a bit more visibility, although the extra visibility was obstructed by the steering wheel.
I bet you had a separate indicator for left turn signal and right turn signal, but do you really need that? --- a single indicator if any turn signal is active is plenty.
I still don't understand how these massive touchscreen displays are allowed in vehicles.
I had to rent a van that had everything "integrated" in its display. Absolutely atrocious software, latency and responsiveness for standard things such as temp and fan speed.
Also withholding this "extra" means you have to take your eyes off the road and look down to the right/left to make sure you're doing the right speed. Sounds a bit over the top, but I wonder if these designers think about the fact they might actually be the ones responsible for people dying in crashes.
A lot of Minis had the central speedo. Unsure if it's true or just automotive legend, but allegedly it was for cost cutting (fewer changes between left hand drive and right hand drive models). So nothing ever changes.
The old jeeps had the speedometer in the middle of the dash. I don't know how that worked but they were never good on road vehicles anyway (they could do it, just not well) and off road you don't need that. Jeeps in the past 30 or 50 years have moved to cars with an off road image. Still better than most off road, but mostly off road is and after-thought in the design.
Because there's a speed display along the left side of the center display. Teslas have been doing this legally for years.
Even before Teslas, I had a Toyota Yaris that had a center mounted instrument cluster a few years ago. I guess it makes it cheaper/easier to sell into both left hand drive and right hand drive markets.
Having something on the center display should not count as acceptable. It certainly doesn't in my book. You need to have the important info in front of you, not off to the side somewhere.
One of the problems with this kind of marketing is that there are essentially no base-models available at dealerships. So the flexibility supposedly provided by making the gauge cluster an option is not actually available to the consumer. This is just a money-grab while advertising a low price.
The ads all show the fully loaded model, "starting from" $LowPrice. We need a rule that the price shown is for the fully loaded model ($HighPrice), maybe fine print "configurable as low as $LowPrice". And then they have to actually allow you to configure that base model, and stock it. Otherwise, it's just effectively false advertising when every dealership gets just one base model that they will not sell to you.
It gets even more fun than that. As a datapoint my parent wanted a manual Honda Accord. In order to be able to advertise that price, Honda had to have a grand total of 3 manual Accords cars available in all of California.
Source -- Had a broker find the car and that was the story the broker told us (they found a manual but we had to travel from San Diego to San Dimas (2 hr drive) to get it.
They will gladly sell you that base model for MSRP (or higher).
Two notes - 1, this applies only to a pair of base models in the Korean market (for now) and 2, the info is still there, but it's on the central screen and not on the instrument cluster behind the wheel.
You can see it in the article's hero image: https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod/images/2fa717dc-2eea-4e...
The thin screen is not always present, but the larger screen shows the same info upper-left.
As a driver I would be so freaking confused staring at the empty space behind the wheel. Maybe it is just my Gen X experience of learning to drive on a stick and paying attention to tachometer and coolant temp.
I drove a Toyota Yaris for about 10 years and those cars had the instrument cluster in the middle of the dash. It didn’t take long to get used to and one of the unexpected benefits was how much better forward visibility was. The Yaris wasn’t a big car but honestly the drivers position felt a lot more open and less cramped with that layout, and realistically the center of the dash is almost always empty space anyway. I personally liked it a lot. Not sure the “no instrument cluster + massive iPad in the center” is going to be quite the same feel or work as well, but everything being in the center feels way less weird than you would think.
> Maybe it is just my Gen X experience of learning to drive on a stick and paying attention to tachometer and coolant temp.
You and your fancy cars... my 1981 Vanagon doesn't have fancy stuff like a tach or a trip meter or a temperature gauge. Who needs a tach when you have ears, and anyway there's a colored dot on the speedometer at the top end of first, two dots at the top end of 2nd and three dots at the top end of 3rd. If you go over, the rev limiter will let you know.
While working on the speedometer, I did drive it a bit with no cluster installed, and it was weird, but I could get used to a bit more visibility, although the extra visibility was obstructed by the steering wheel.
I bet you had a separate indicator for left turn signal and right turn signal, but do you really need that? --- a single indicator if any turn signal is active is plenty.
[dead]
I still don't understand how these massive touchscreen displays are allowed in vehicles.
I had to rent a van that had everything "integrated" in its display. Absolutely atrocious software, latency and responsiveness for standard things such as temp and fan speed.
Also withholding this "extra" means you have to take your eyes off the road and look down to the right/left to make sure you're doing the right speed. Sounds a bit over the top, but I wonder if these designers think about the fact they might actually be the ones responsible for people dying in crashes.
Wow, I was hoping this was an option to not have the stupid center-mounted huge screen. I'd pay extra for analog controls.
A lot of Minis had the central speedo. Unsure if it's true or just automotive legend, but allegedly it was for cost cutting (fewer changes between left hand drive and right hand drive models). So nothing ever changes.
The old jeeps had the speedometer in the middle of the dash. I don't know how that worked but they were never good on road vehicles anyway (they could do it, just not well) and off road you don't need that. Jeeps in the past 30 or 50 years have moved to cars with an off road image. Still better than most off road, but mostly off road is and after-thought in the design.
- I’m sorry officer I didn’t know I was speeding. My car isn’t equipped with an instrument cluster.
- Oh, I see, go on then.
More like "That's weird. Here's your ticket. Wait here while I figure out if you're even allowed to drive this thing."
I'm old enough to remember when 'automatic transmission' was a luxury option that cost more; standard (transmission) was the default.
Auto makers are always looking for ways to differentiate, upsell, and tap demand.
Porsche is now charging extra for a "standard" transmission
https://www.edmunds.com/car-news/2027-porsche-911-carrera-s-...
Maybe that's a good idea... https://youtu.be/5fbuRCLQEsQ
If you looked at the new 4runner and land cruiser, it's essentially the same thing but packaged in a higher trim.
At the same time, what do you really need in an instrument cluster besides the fuel, rpm/battery charge and speedometer?
Engine/coolant temperature can be pretty important.
thats hidden nowadays and its a light vs a gauge but agree
Only if towing
How can it be legal to not have any kind of speed display in front of the driver?
Because there's a speed display along the left side of the center display. Teslas have been doing this legally for years.
Even before Teslas, I had a Toyota Yaris that had a center mounted instrument cluster a few years ago. I guess it makes it cheaper/easier to sell into both left hand drive and right hand drive markets.
Having something on the center display should not count as acceptable. It certainly doesn't in my book. You need to have the important info in front of you, not off to the side somewhere.
My model 3 doesn't even HAVE an option to pay extra for a display directly in front of the driver.
I remember having a car that had a speedometer and a fuel gauge. Nothing else. This seems similar.
I don’t need anything else
Straight to jail.
of course the digitization of more of our lives will take the natural course to unlockable cosmetic items
Well now we know that José Muñoz is evil and psychotic.