Because American auto makers convinced the government that BYD is price dumping in every market segment at the same time and somehow staying profitable.
I saw a print ad for a brand new Toyota Corolla back in 1974—something like $2500 or so. Running the inflation numbers: where are the $17K cars today? Why is the average US new car $50K now.
To be sure, I know there are a lot more regulations on car manufacturers now, and tech in the cars, but come on!
Querying Claude: "Manufacturers have responded by prioritizing profit, concentrating inventory at higher price points…", "2026 is the first year in the U.S. with no new car priced under $20,000."
Cars in the US are the ultimate regressive tax. The blue-collar worker that needs a car to get to work, the guy that mows lawns for a living, the maids… Sure, used cars are a thing (my first car in my 1984 was in fact a Datsun B-210 that I paid $400 for). But I think everyone has noticed that used car prices are through the roof as well.
The Japanese came in and handed the US car manufacturers their asses in the 70's. We might need something like that again.
What a hot dump for 25k. The current corolla in all its glory and odd mix of old and new technologies should be a 15k otd car, but instead its seen as a value at 25k and will provide years of boring value for a barely attentive driver.
The Chinese government is effectively giving all manufacturers 0% financing and raw materials at cost.
And even still, BYD executives have come out and said their pricing is not sustainable. The Chinese market is engaging in a massive price war and BYD's strategy is to entrench themselves in new markets with "aggressive" introductory pricing campaigns.
The Europeans did a survey and pegged the value of BYD's government support at 17%. I trust that number as an upper limit because the European government would have had lots of incentive to be thorough and to err on the side of over estimating.
Not to say you're wrong, but BYD could still be price dumping in several markets, while being quietly propped up by the Chinese government. I'm not convinced that's the case, but it's still possible.
The kind of corporate-socialism that would allow a government to dump cash into an otherwise uncompetitive domestic automotive manufacturer to keep it afloat though, is more an American thing. If American auto manufacturers are right, and BYD is receiving government help, the hypocrisy would be nearly unbelievable
Also, every car manufacturer has to go through crash testing and homologation in order to sell cars directly to US consumers. And, without a parts supply chain, maintaining a car becomes very difficult. So even paying 200-300% over the sale price with third-party homologation makes private importation expensive, painful, and slow.
Regulatory capture, legalized bribery whoops I mean political donations, and protectionism. Gotta let Detroit keep making crappy bro-dozers that get 15MPG.
The average American's longest-kept car is 8 years old. Therefore every eight years or so, Americans are forced to spend a significant amount of money on a car. The median price of a new car in the United States is ~$41,000. If we generously claim that a Chinese car with the same capabilities could be purchased for minimum $30,000 instead, then the number of money being lost to being forced to purchase a more expensive car, every eight years, is 11,000*350 million, or ~3.8 trillion dollars. Dividing per year, we get roughly 480 billion dollars per year that could be spent by Americans.
I'm not an economist nor a mathematician, so I will not claim that this is a good expression of the economic impact of these restrictions. But I will say that the average American does not care about which country his or her car originates from. They care about navigating our crumbling infrastructure through the only means possible, the car. We have no reliable public transport in 99% of this country nor alternative modes of transport. We are forced to buy cars.
It seems unfair to me that the average American, who is making less and less per year after we adjust for inflation and purchasing power, should be forced to carry the burden of a technologically backwards industry that is still pumping out millions of gas-powered vehicles, which are not only bad for the environment, but are even more expensive to operate compared to the cost of electric cars per mile.
Our country does not think ahead, all of our decisions just temporarily patch our longstanding issues. America is screwed.
I don't think tbis quite holds - money being spent on domestically produced vehicles should be going to working families, so the money stays and is spent again in the country. Now if most of that money just goes to the mega rich, then it's fairly pointless.
But it's definitely more complex than just money saved = money spent elsewhere
I agree with this. It certainly is more complex than just that. Only yesterday was I thinking about this topic, as I was walking around Osaka and looking at the cars over there. I would like to see an actual study on this question.
They are in the EU. The tariff is 27% so they aren't as numerous as they would be without it but there are still plenty.
There will probably be a lot more starting next year since they are building a factory in the EU which is scheduled to start production at the end of this year. That bypasses tariffs.
Apologies, I was looking at European Union. I see Norway is not imposing tariffs and there may be variance in other non EU countries as well. Thank you for pointing out the issue.
Detroit will be laughing when a "worldwide economy hiccup" occurs and BYD starts abandoning any service-warrantee centers all across Europe. No parts, no service, send it to the scrap yard.
There are also fleet emmission fines for ICEs so it's not so bad (and very expensive fuel too). Otoh you need buy-in from the population, so making domestic EVs more attractive than foreign ones is one of the better ways to do that.
That's a pretty stunning price. For context I was looking at a second hand 2018 Nissan Leaf (grey import here in Australia) a couple weeks ago for 20k.
TL;DR: AUD 19,900 driveway (means taxes, registration etc included), or about US$14k. The main limitation is the 220 km (135 mi) range, which is fine for a city runabout but not great for road tripping.
Australia doesn’t tariff Chinese car imports, on account of no longer having any car industry of our own to defend.
That said we do still have a hefty “luxury car tax” for anything over $80k, which is a hangover from when there was an industry here. The government aren’t going to lift that any time soon.
Its current function is to select for expensive trucks over expensive sedans, because trucks are “commercial” and exempt, making our roads less safe overall. Thanks government.
So you are saying that there's a widespread problem with people looking to buy a car for $100k but realizing there's a $6k tax they go, "I can't afford that" and instead buy a unsafe truck?
Another part of the picture is that you can more often get away with buying a truck “for business” if you’re a small business-person, regardless of whether it actually ends up being used for that.
And by ‘unsafe’ I mean for pedestrians and they contribute to the vehicle-size arms race on the roads, they’re generally very safe for the occupants.
I bought a 4 year old leaf with 25k on the clock in May for £7k ($10k). Get about 150 miles on a full charge. I’d rather a little more as I tend to do 90 a day, so if it doesn’t charge offpeak overnight for some reason I’m left with a manual recharge during the day. But I do a lot of miles (25k a year)
The main downside on long trips is the DC is chamedo, not standard ccs, so there are fewer locations and they are sometimes broken or full.
It’s pretty tiny too, so not a road trip car IMHO.
That said, coupled with home solar to power it, this is a very cheap way to get on the road and I will likely go this direction in future - one of these for the city and something a bit bigger/more rugged to go bush once in a while.
Been thinking more along the lines of the Munda-biddy actually :)
But I haven’t got on my bike for a few years now because at the moment all my spare energy goes on managing our plot. There’s always something needs moving, sawing, building, repairing, digging… So I’ve gone from having a (pudgy) cyclist’s physique with very strong calves to more of a farmer’s build with bigger arm and shoulder muscles than I’ve ever had before and a big ‘ol belly.
But in all seriousness I also like to go remote once in a while and access national parks. I’m not going to be hooning it round destroying dunes, but getting to beautiful places like Cape Peron is tough without a the right vehicle.
I've been through the Bungles on a push bike - so that's a thing, but yeah, Cape Peron would be a hard slog without a boat or vehicle that can push across deep sand - water would be a tough carry.
> without the right vehicle
A loong time ago (late 1970s) I got to traverse the horizontal falls a couple of time in a home made sea kayak after being dropped off "nearby" (and later picked up again) by an old pearling lugger .. pretty low carbon effort that one, just a lot of paddling (and fishing, and digging for fresh water, and dodging the odd shark and salty croc).
I want solar and a battery (don’t have it yet, it’s on the list) to cut my energy bills and guard against power cuts anyway.
So neither of these things is an ‘extra’ expense for me getting a small EV.
There are a total of 5 corollas available in Australia for $2k or less. Each one is ratty, beat up and 19+ years old, I wouldn’t want to chance taking any of them on the freeway, and you’d still have to fuel them.
Will be earth shattering when the CCP "pulls the plug" and then BYD and other Chinese manufacturers fail to honor vehicle warranties, even abandon their warrantee / service centers throughout the world
With free electricity bring offered in the afternoon because of excess solar would be a great car for most peoples daily commute cheaper even than public transport as this is less than $6 per day over 10 years
Australia is one of the most urbanized countries in the world with 87% of its population living in cities and suburbs. Being car dependent is a political choice pushed by the car industry for decades. Getting people into public transports, onto bicycles or their two feet requires reducing the vast space cities waste on privately owned cars. Super blocks that focus on active travel, less surface parking space and slower speeds are what is needed.
All infrastructure for cars and the fallout from their pollution (don't forget the tyres) is heavily subsidized by the tax payer and not as cost effective as a tram or railway.
I agree with you but the Opal fares in Sydney are more expensive than it would cost me in tolls driving across the bridge and paying for parking at work. I still don't often drive but it's not because PT is more economical.
Yeah we have too much urban sprawl, and too few people, to justify widespread public transport to eliminate the need for a household car (in Australia).
With the rising living standards and a looming population cliff due to the one-child-policy wages in China have steadily been rising - and they'll get even higher in the future. Any Chinese industry relying on cheap and mostly-unskilled labor is in serious trouble. They know this, which is why they have been heavily pushing for automation. As a result, companies like BYD have been setting up "dark factories" for a while now.
Want cars made by overworked and underpaid workers? These days that means buying American.
The irony of your comment is that these chinese evs are made by some of the most heavily automated manufacturing lines. (Not disputing that there are exploited workers here)
But I hope you aren't buying any phones, laptops which indeed have lot of exploitation and sometimes even slave labour (see cobalt mining in DRC). Or not buying any supermarket meat, eggs or milk. It is incredibly easy to pass a moralistic judgement.
Not disagreeing with you, but also two wrongs don't make a right. Just because someone else, or someone does 'thing A' that's disagreeable, doesn't mean doing 'thing B' becomes fine.
In NZ there are BYDs everywhere. Why are they not in US yet?
Because American auto makers convinced the government that BYD is price dumping in every market segment at the same time and somehow staying profitable.
I saw a print ad for a brand new Toyota Corolla back in 1974—something like $2500 or so. Running the inflation numbers: where are the $17K cars today? Why is the average US new car $50K now.
To be sure, I know there are a lot more regulations on car manufacturers now, and tech in the cars, but come on!
Querying Claude: "Manufacturers have responded by prioritizing profit, concentrating inventory at higher price points…", "2026 is the first year in the U.S. with no new car priced under $20,000."
Cars in the US are the ultimate regressive tax. The blue-collar worker that needs a car to get to work, the guy that mows lawns for a living, the maids… Sure, used cars are a thing (my first car in my 1984 was in fact a Datsun B-210 that I paid $400 for). But I think everyone has noticed that used car prices are through the roof as well.
The Japanese came in and handed the US car manufacturers their asses in the 70's. We might need something like that again.
New Corola is advertised at $25k. Fair price considering how many features you get vs 1974 car.
What a hot dump for 25k. The current corolla in all its glory and odd mix of old and new technologies should be a 15k otd car, but instead its seen as a value at 25k and will provide years of boring value for a barely attentive driver.
But I mean, they are.
The Chinese government is effectively giving all manufacturers 0% financing and raw materials at cost.
And even still, BYD executives have come out and said their pricing is not sustainable. The Chinese market is engaging in a massive price war and BYD's strategy is to entrench themselves in new markets with "aggressive" introductory pricing campaigns.
The Europeans did a survey and pegged the value of BYD's government support at 17%. I trust that number as an upper limit because the European government would have had lots of incentive to be thorough and to err on the side of over estimating.
So essentially the same thing the AI companies are doing
When Chinese companies do it, then it is evil price dumping.
When US companies do it, then it is just good business strategy, investing in growth for future profits.
Do US companies have free access to Chinese markets?
More than vice versa.
I love this sort of reply.
Yes, the bastion of free market capitalism is no much different than the evil communist countries.
Not to say you're wrong, but BYD could still be price dumping in several markets, while being quietly propped up by the Chinese government. I'm not convinced that's the case, but it's still possible.
The kind of corporate-socialism that would allow a government to dump cash into an otherwise uncompetitive domestic automotive manufacturer to keep it afloat though, is more an American thing. If American auto manufacturers are right, and BYD is receiving government help, the hypocrisy would be nearly unbelievable
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Tariffs, the tariff on Chinese vehicles is 100%.
America now bans Chinese stuff. Some Chinese carmakers are explicitly banned in USA.
Also, every car manufacturer has to go through crash testing and homologation in order to sell cars directly to US consumers. And, without a parts supply chain, maintaining a car becomes very difficult. So even paying 200-300% over the sale price with third-party homologation makes private importation expensive, painful, and slow.
Freedom
Didn't Americans send all their freedom to Iran?
You mean the state of Iran?
Yes, and now they're running out.
So now Iran with their freedom ?
yes, diesel is 1 cent per liter. For $50 can drive the whole month non stop.
Freedom from those pesky car manufacturers that demand protection of domestic workforce?
No they arent? See BYD for sure, but see most other brands more often still.
Regulatory capture, legalized bribery whoops I mean political donations, and protectionism. Gotta let Detroit keep making crappy bro-dozers that get 15MPG.
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just destroy your industrial base and become fully dependent on china bro
The average American's longest-kept car is 8 years old. Therefore every eight years or so, Americans are forced to spend a significant amount of money on a car. The median price of a new car in the United States is ~$41,000. If we generously claim that a Chinese car with the same capabilities could be purchased for minimum $30,000 instead, then the number of money being lost to being forced to purchase a more expensive car, every eight years, is 11,000*350 million, or ~3.8 trillion dollars. Dividing per year, we get roughly 480 billion dollars per year that could be spent by Americans.
I'm not an economist nor a mathematician, so I will not claim that this is a good expression of the economic impact of these restrictions. But I will say that the average American does not care about which country his or her car originates from. They care about navigating our crumbling infrastructure through the only means possible, the car. We have no reliable public transport in 99% of this country nor alternative modes of transport. We are forced to buy cars.
It seems unfair to me that the average American, who is making less and less per year after we adjust for inflation and purchasing power, should be forced to carry the burden of a technologically backwards industry that is still pumping out millions of gas-powered vehicles, which are not only bad for the environment, but are even more expensive to operate compared to the cost of electric cars per mile.
Our country does not think ahead, all of our decisions just temporarily patch our longstanding issues. America is screwed.
How do you feel about offshoring IT work to countries with much lower cost of living?
I don't think tbis quite holds - money being spent on domestically produced vehicles should be going to working families, so the money stays and is spent again in the country. Now if most of that money just goes to the mega rich, then it's fairly pointless.
But it's definitely more complex than just money saved = money spent elsewhere
I agree with this. It certainly is more complex than just that. Only yesterday was I thinking about this topic, as I was walking around Osaka and looking at the cars over there. I would like to see an actual study on this question.
America voted for it.
Yes America is a pure democracy and we have complete freedom of choice
Same reason they are not in EU, tarrifs.
They are in the EU. The tariff is 27% so they aren't as numerous as they would be without it but there are still plenty.
There will probably be a lot more starting next year since they are building a factory in the EU which is scheduled to start production at the end of this year. That bypasses tariffs.
"BYD faces a 17% tariff on imported electric vehicles in EU, in addition to the standard 10% base rate."
"BYD has sold 19,241 fully electric and plug-in hybrid vehicles in Europe last month, a 255% soar from the same period a year ago."
Small numbers, but I am pretty sure they're in Europe. https://eletric-vehicles.com/byd/byd-sales-in-europe-more-th...
Edited: Tariffs vary across Europe, particularly in non EU nations.
There is no fixed tariff in Europe like you are quoting. It varies.
Apologies, I was looking at European Union. I see Norway is not imposing tariffs and there may be variance in other non EU countries as well. Thank you for pointing out the issue.
Detroit will be laughing when a "worldwide economy hiccup" occurs and BYD starts abandoning any service-warrantee centers all across Europe. No parts, no service, send it to the scrap yard.
It’s so annoying that the EU is artificially hampering EV adoption to protect their outdated fossil fuel car manufacturers.
There are also fleet emmission fines for ICEs so it's not so bad (and very expensive fuel too). Otoh you need buy-in from the population, so making domestic EVs more attractive than foreign ones is one of the better ways to do that.
Tariffs can’t stop “technology” and “manufacturing.”
I see many in my part of the eu.
When they say cheapest, they mean cheapest new car including petrol cars.
I have no idea why ICE cars are so pricey nowadays here.
That's a pretty stunning price. For context I was looking at a second hand 2018 Nissan Leaf (grey import here in Australia) a couple weeks ago for 20k.
Non-video story: https://thedriven.io/2026/09/16/australias-cheapest-new-car-...
TL;DR: AUD 19,900 driveway (means taxes, registration etc included), or about US$14k. The main limitation is the 220 km (135 mi) range, which is fine for a city runabout but not great for road tripping.
That's an insane price and the range is fine for the daily needs of the large majority of people.
€12k in France (where i am) can't get you any new car, even the cheapest ICE Dacia is more expensive than that now.
The BYD is sold in Europe but there is higher VAT and a special EU Chinese car import tax - so these cars are about 20k euro.
There is also the Renault Twingo which is in the same class.
The tax is only on electric cars, vehicles with a combustion engine are excempt - that's why you see all those ads for BYD Hybrids now.
Elsewhere in the thread you claim there are no BYD cars in the EU, yet here you're an expert on the taxes BYD pays in the EU.
I checked the Twingo and it is starting at €16k and an Opel Corsa (without any options) is more than €19k
Australia doesn’t tariff Chinese car imports, on account of no longer having any car industry of our own to defend.
That said we do still have a hefty “luxury car tax” for anything over $80k, which is a hangover from when there was an industry here. The government aren’t going to lift that any time soon.
Its current function is to select for expensive trucks over expensive sedans, because trucks are “commercial” and exempt, making our roads less safe overall. Thanks government.
So you are saying that there's a widespread problem with people looking to buy a car for $100k but realizing there's a $6k tax they go, "I can't afford that" and instead buy a unsafe truck?
Taxes change purchase behaviour. The luxury car tax is a tax on personal vehicles so they're saying its pushing people towards buying via business
It certainly forms part of the picture.
Another part of the picture is that you can more often get away with buying a truck “for business” if you’re a small business-person, regardless of whether it actually ends up being used for that.
And by ‘unsafe’ I mean for pedestrians and they contribute to the vehicle-size arms race on the roads, they’re generally very safe for the occupants.
Seems like the luxury tax is 33%..
I'd love a city run around car inclusive of all taxes for $15k or less.
I bought a 4 year old leaf with 25k on the clock in May for £7k ($10k). Get about 150 miles on a full charge. I’d rather a little more as I tend to do 90 a day, so if it doesn’t charge offpeak overnight for some reason I’m left with a manual recharge during the day. But I do a lot of miles (25k a year)
The main downside on long trips is the DC is chamedo, not standard ccs, so there are fewer locations and they are sometimes broken or full.
Range isn't a big issue in recent generation BYD vehicles that support FLASH Charging in areas that have 1.5MW chargers.
I doubt a $15k econobox ev is going to support 1.5MW charging.
Also, I think you are underestimating the sheer size and desolate spreaded-outness of Australia.
It’s pretty tiny too, so not a road trip car IMHO.
That said, coupled with home solar to power it, this is a very cheap way to get on the road and I will likely go this direction in future - one of these for the city and something a bit bigger/more rugged to go bush once in a while.
> a bit bigger/more rugged to go bush once in a while.
Depends whether you're taking the Birdsville track or the Bibbulmun track really.
The shorter one can be done a on a red postie bike, the longer one won't even need that :-)
Been thinking more along the lines of the Munda-biddy actually :)
But I haven’t got on my bike for a few years now because at the moment all my spare energy goes on managing our plot. There’s always something needs moving, sawing, building, repairing, digging… So I’ve gone from having a (pudgy) cyclist’s physique with very strong calves to more of a farmer’s build with bigger arm and shoulder muscles than I’ve ever had before and a big ‘ol belly.
But in all seriousness I also like to go remote once in a while and access national parks. I’m not going to be hooning it round destroying dunes, but getting to beautiful places like Cape Peron is tough without a the right vehicle.
I've been through the Bungles on a push bike - so that's a thing, but yeah, Cape Peron would be a hard slog without a boat or vehicle that can push across deep sand - water would be a tough carry.
> without the right vehicle
A loong time ago (late 1970s) I got to traverse the horizontal falls a couple of time in a home made sea kayak after being dropped off "nearby" (and later picked up again) by an old pearling lugger .. pretty low carbon effort that one, just a lot of paddling (and fishing, and digging for fresh water, and dodging the odd shark and salty croc).
Nice, I have great respect but also a level of “WTF” when encountering cyclists in the deep wilds, especially in the heat!
Passed an old guy on a pushbike with a trailer on the nullabor in 2010 and just thought “wow, that’s commitment”
$20k for the car plus $5k for roof top solar, plus $500,000 for the house to put it on.
Or: a $2000 Corolla and the rental home you’re already in.
500k doesn't get you much house in Australia these days, try double that.
$500,000? That's just the price for the garage.
That's great if you already have a clean, high mileage Corolla or Accord, but good luck finding one for 2k
I’m not in a rental home, and wouldn’t be anyway.
I want solar and a battery (don’t have it yet, it’s on the list) to cut my energy bills and guard against power cuts anyway.
So neither of these things is an ‘extra’ expense for me getting a small EV.
There are a total of 5 corollas available in Australia for $2k or less. Each one is ratty, beat up and 19+ years old, I wouldn’t want to chance taking any of them on the freeway, and you’d still have to fuel them.
Will be earth shattering when the CCP "pulls the plug" and then BYD and other Chinese manufacturers fail to honor vehicle warranties, even abandon their warrantee / service centers throughout the world
With free electricity bring offered in the afternoon because of excess solar would be a great car for most peoples daily commute cheaper even than public transport as this is less than $6 per day over 10 years
This is sad news, city have to get rid of cars, and make public transport free if needed
Cheaper EVs is a good thing.
Australia is more than cities.
Cities can make public transport free and congestion charges if they want to reduce usage of cars.
Australia is one of the most urbanized countries in the world with 87% of its population living in cities and suburbs. Being car dependent is a political choice pushed by the car industry for decades. Getting people into public transports, onto bicycles or their two feet requires reducing the vast space cities waste on privately owned cars. Super blocks that focus on active travel, less surface parking space and slower speeds are what is needed.
I cycle in Sydney, and wish more others did. I have no car.
But there's a few things that make this trickier in Sydney, than, say, much of European cities:
* Sydney is too hot/UV to comfortably cycle between 9AM-5PM for at least 4 months of the year. Maybe tree-lined corridors could help that.
* Sydney is very hilly. It didn't have centuries of being flattened. This makes it challenging, even for experienced commuters. Ebikes could help.
* Sydney has low density: houses are big, detached, and thus spread apart. This makes relevant cycling distances further.
EVs are much more aligned with Sydney, at least for tackling the polluting issues with cars.
I don’t think congestion charges would cover building/maintaining public transport.
All infrastructure for cars and the fallout from their pollution (don't forget the tyres) is heavily subsidized by the tax payer and not as cost effective as a tram or railway.
I agree with you but the Opal fares in Sydney are more expensive than it would cost me in tolls driving across the bridge and paying for parking at work. I still don't often drive but it's not because PT is more economical.
exactly this...Opal pricing, what are they thinking? I can pay petrol twice and still be ahead
Yeah we have too much urban sprawl, and too few people, to justify widespread public transport to eliminate the need for a household car (in Australia).
we can electrify our cars and build public transport simultaneously!
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Made by extremely overworked and underpaid workers. For either moral or safety reason, you shouldn't buy them.
Rather the opposite, actually.
With the rising living standards and a looming population cliff due to the one-child-policy wages in China have steadily been rising - and they'll get even higher in the future. Any Chinese industry relying on cheap and mostly-unskilled labor is in serious trouble. They know this, which is why they have been heavily pushing for automation. As a result, companies like BYD have been setting up "dark factories" for a while now.
Want cars made by overworked and underpaid workers? These days that means buying American.
The irony of your comment is that these chinese evs are made by some of the most heavily automated manufacturing lines. (Not disputing that there are exploited workers here)
But I hope you aren't buying any phones, laptops which indeed have lot of exploitation and sometimes even slave labour (see cobalt mining in DRC). Or not buying any supermarket meat, eggs or milk. It is incredibly easy to pass a moralistic judgement.
Not disagreeing with you, but also two wrongs don't make a right. Just because someone else, or someone does 'thing A' that's disagreeable, doesn't mean doing 'thing B' becomes fine.